For you Bleevers'!

[Carol Nistri]

Heres where I stand at the moment,my husband and myself have seen ufos,four to be exact.Ive never seen an Alien nor do I know anyone who has.However when we witnessed those four ufos it was apparent they were under intelligent control.I take it you dont believe that people are being abducted or did I misread your post Khtiraa?

[Khtiraa]

Originally Posted by Mr Magoo

Well i base what i know on fact...yours is purely speculation...No one to date has produced any hard evidence to prove that an intrelligent alien race has os is visiting this planet. Skeptics weigh up the evidence...believers blindly accept anything!

Like a true skeptic, you cherry pick the facts that apply to Your point of reference. And I say this with all due respect to the rights of free speech and free thought. Believers have their own baggage. But there's something contemptibly negative about the methodology of excessive fact-mongering. Why in the hell would someone want to screw up a great conversation, an exchange of thought in the common expression of interests? Everyone claims to be searching for the truth. But, while some of us actually engage in positive discourse, others act out in ways which interrupt the flow of friendly dispute with sermons of doubt and rebuttal, based solely on fact that nothing can be proven.

Stating the obvious is both redundant and meaningless. Those of us who actually engage the subject matter already know that it's all speculation. So, what's the problem, you don't like to see people communicate? You're lonely, have nothing of interest to say, incompetent? What's the deal?

[Khtiraa]

Originally Posted by Carol Nistri

Heres where I stand at the moment,my husband and myself have seen ufos,four to be exact.Ive never seen an Alien nor do I know anyone who has.However when we witnessed those four ufos it was apparent they were under intelligent control.I take it you dont believe that people are being abducted or did I misread your post Khtiraa?

I have no idea where you read any of my posts stating that I didn't believe in alien abductions. For me, it's not necessary to believe or deny that abductions are occurring. I've read up on personal accounts, research and have seen first hand how such an experience profoundly changes the psyche of a person who has recall. The research data supports the claim that people are physically and psychologically abducted by non-humans, wherever they are from. Anyone who wants to argue the point is just bloating his own opinion. I don't like the idea that this happens, but it does. Some accounts are so stunning that it would be easy for me to take the skeptics' approach and just deny the whole affair with a blanket statement that precludes anything other than a deceased flesh and bone alien.

[StephieM]

I think Khitraa makes a good point. The skeptics say they too are searching for the truth, but whenever we try to have a good conversation about that truth we get side swiped by the unremitting chant that everything is based on speculation and "soft" evidence. However I've come to the conclussion that most skeptics aren't interested in the truth at all, that they are more interesting in debunking and disproving the theory of extraterrestrial visitation. Hence the reasons for side swiping every conversation on the matter. Bringing up bogus claims, videos, and questionable individuals in the field, is to purposely bolster their opinions and make the believers feel like idiots. Their assumptions that every person that believes that aliens are visiting our planet therefore must believe in all things related to such, is biased to say the least. We aren't going to get any closer to affirming the truth by entertaining false claims and shoddy investigations., therefore any serious believer will look at any one thing objectively before jumping to conclusions.

[StephieM]

Originally Posted by Khtiraa

I have no idea where you read any of my posts stating that I didn't believe in alien abductions. For me, it's not necessary to believe or deny that abductions are occurring. I've read up on personal accounts, research and have seen first hand how such an experience profoundly changes the psyche of a person who has recall. The research data supports the claim that people are physically and psychologically abducted by non-humans, wherever they are from. Anyone who wants to argue the point is just bloating his own opinion. I don't like the idea that this happens, but it does. Some accounts are so stunning that it would be easy for me to take the skeptics' approach and just deny the whole affair with a blanket statement that precludes anything other than a deceased flesh and bone alien.

In Carol's defense, I think she may have assumed this because of your feelings on Dr. Leir's investigation. I was having the same thoughts myself. But I understand where you're coming from now. It's not that you don't believe in abductions, but that you are disappointed that his investigation in the matter hasn't brought in conclusive results. I'll be honest, I really haven't read much on the topic so I can't say one way or another whether I believe such a thing is happening, but I'm not going to rule out the possiblility. It's an interesting subject, one I may look into sooner than later. However, in Dr. Leir's cases, I thought it very strange that there was no scarring from where these objects were "implanted". If these objects were just medals embedded in the skin as a child or what not, could they have moved through the body since then and maybe they are just looking in the wrong place for the scar? But I guess that wouldn't account for all the other unusual aspects of the object. Has anyone ever theorized on the reason behind these implants?

[Mr Magoo]

So, what's the problem, you don't like to see people communicate? You're lonely, have nothing of interest to say, incompetent? What's the deal?

There you go speculating again,,you know nothing about me....but we have the typical believer response ...insults instead of evidence...GROW UP!!!!!!

[Carol Nistri]

Steph,the alien abduction scenerio has my attention bigtime.It seems to be the very reason for alien visitation and ufo sightings as well.Its the only story that comes back again and again. If its true and many believe it is then theres your story,there here to abduct selected individuals with the sole purpose of creating a hybrid race of beings,part us and part them.Its to bizzare for words and there are also many that refuse to believe this could be happening,I dont blame them at all for not believing this,but nevertheless its the one story thats repeated over and over again.

Khatriaa said in part,"have seen first hand how such an experience profoundly changes the psyche of a person who has recall"

I would love to hear this from you Khatriaa do I understand that you actually saw someone regressed?

[BRB]

Why are people waiting for evidence to satisfy the scientific community, as if we know everything there is to know about the universe? The scientific community has only come so far and what we're dealing with is in contrast with and appears to surpass what the scientific community holds true. The scientific community doesn't know everything and in saying that evidence doesn't satisfy them is like saying you can't fit a square block in a circular opening. The scientific community could be trying to weigh something that's weightless, and because it produces no value to their weight scale, are determining that there's nothing there, when in fact, they could be completely wrong, as they have been in the past. Skeptics always ask 'why haven't ETs contacted us in a way that science can affirm?' Maybe they are trying to make contact but are doing so on a different medium, one that science doesn't account for. Maybe skeptics should stop acting like spoiled brats, get off their asses and learn something about what they don't know rather than patting themselves on the back over the stuff they do know, which isn't as much as they'd like to think. We're the ones who have something to learn here and it's disappointing to see people acting as if others (ETs) are the ones who should be making the effort to expand our awareness. Bad attitude out there.

[dr wu23]

Perhaps we need a middle ground where objective verifiable evidence meets subjective belief and 'soft evidence' and anecdotal material.
Science can indeed be too demanding when it comes to proof (I'm guilty of that from time to time) ,but those who believe on subjective anecdotal material (mostly) can be too believing.
As to the criticisms regarding science, it's the only game in town where one can bring factual evidence and have it peer reviewed and authenticated. When undeniable proof of aliens/et's finally arrives it will be determined and verified by established scientific groups and not by ufology or ufo groups, though it could surface via those grassroots groups.

In the end science and the authorities will be the ones running the show when the aliens land ( or are revealed through some manner) and not the public ufo groups. That may be a bitter pill for those groups to swallow but it's the way it is.

[mercuryrapids]

Originally Posted by dr wu23

In the end science and the authorities will be the ones running the show when the aliens land

At least that's what the authorities would like... lol